Description:
John Alexander talks about growing up in Nowata, Oklahoma and living in Atlanta and Oklahoma City.
Transcript:
Interviewee: John Alexander
Interviewer: Melba
Interview Date: 11/15/2007
Interview Location: Ralph Ellison LibraryMelba: Good afternoon Mr. Alexander. How are you doing today?
John Alexander: Just fine.
M: Good. What is your name? Give me your name.
JA: John C. Alexander.
M: And your birthdate?
JA: 1/13/39.
M: And where we are located?
JA: Where we’re located?
M: Where we’re located right now.
JA: Oh, in the library. What is this?
M: Ralph Ellison.
JA: The Ralph Ellison Library.
M: Where were you born?
JA: I was born in Claremore, Oklahoma.
M: Where did you grow up?
JA: Primarily I grew up in Nowata, Oklahoma.
M: What was that like?
JA: Well, with my father being principal and my mother a teacher, it was [laughs] it was okay.
M: What was the name of the school your father was a principal at in Nowata?
JA: Lincoln.
M: What was the name of the school where your mother taught in Nowata?
JA: Lincoln.
M: At Lincoln. How would you describe your relationship with your father?
JA: By him being my principal for eleven years, it was pretty good. I spent a lot of time in his office. [both laugh]
M: Were you in trouble when you went into his office or were you just visiting your dad?
JA: A little of both.
M: What about growing up with your mom? What was she like?
JA: She was a teacher of mine also in the fourth, fifth, and sixth grade.
M: What did she teach you?
JA: We only had one teacher for the fourth, fifth, and sixth grade, so everything that was taught at that level, she taught it.
M: Elementary.
JA: In elementary school, yes. She also was over the chorale. Everybody had to participate in the choir. There wasn’t that many students there.
M: Did you enjoy that?
JA: Somewhat. Most of the time I did. [laughs]
M: Did you have any brothers?
JA: I had one brother.
M: What was his name?
JA: Floyd M. Alexander.
M: Did you have any sisters?
JA: No sisters.
M: What was your brother like?
JA: He was a year and eight months older than I was, so we were pretty close coming up. Both of us suffered through the same situation by going to school with our parents. [M laughs]
M: When you say you suffered, tell me more about that. I didn’t grow up with parents that were teachers, so you’ve got to let me know what you mean by that.
JA: Well, we were supposed to be setting examples for the other kids, so we if got a little bit out of order, we got punished for it. I got immune to it.
M: You got immune to the punishment?
JA: Yeah.
[both laugh]
M: That is hilarious. That is interesting.
JA: I’d get so many whippings in the office that it didn’t faze me anymore.
M: They couldn’t wait until you got home? They had to go on and get you during school.
JA: Right at school, yeah.
[M laughs]
M: Well, I don’t know what to say if you got immune to it right there in the office. What did you do to work it out since you got where you was trying not to let it faze you?
JA: What’d I do to work it out?
M: Yeah.
JA: I just went on and forgot about it. It was just another day.
[both laugh]
M: Do you remember your grandparents?
JA: Only one.
M: Do you want to give that person’s name and whose parent it was in this interview?
JA: It was my mother’s mother.
M: Her name?
JA: Anne Marquess. M-A-R-Q-U-E-S-S. (Note: Pronounced “mar-kwess”)
M: What do you remember about your grandmother Marcus? [Note: M does not pronounce the last name correctly.]
JA: Well, I knew her as Marquess. M-A-R-Q-U-E-S-S.
M: Marquess. Okay.
JA: I knew her until I was about 22. She lived in Philadelphia, primarily. We’d go up and visit during the summer.
M: Philadelphia, Pennsylvania?
JA: Philadelphia, Pennsylvania. Right. My grandfather, her husband, he died before I was born. Both of my father’s parents died before I was born.
M: Do you remember their names?
JA: No, I don’t.
M: Okay. How far back can you trace your family tree? Is that as far back as you can trace it?
JA: Yes. That’s about the essence of it.
M: Do you have a nickname?
JA: [laughing] No.
M: Do you want to name your best friends?
JA: My best friends?
M: Yes.
JA: Most of them are dead.
M: Well, you can name them anyway.
JA: One of my best friends was Curtis Bell, who was a roommate of mine in college.
M: Where did you go to college?
JA: At Morris Brown College in Atlanta.
M: Do you have any other friends?
JA: Like I said, most of them are dead, the best friends that I had.
M: Do you remember what Mr. Bell was like?
JS: Like I said, we were roommates for three years in college and both of us played basketball together. We kept in touch with each other over the last 50-something years until he died last October.
M: I’m sorry to hear that.
JA: I was too.
M: When you were a young person, what would be a perfect day for you?
JA: Going through school one day without getting a whipping. [both laugh]
M: Boy, those whippings were clearly – [stops abruptly and laughs harder]. I bet your father as the principal was having to shake his head and your teaching mother was like, “What are we going to do with that young man?”
JA: Yes, but I had another teacher that she recently died two or three years ago.
M: Who was that?
JA: Mabel Veners. She lived in Vinita and taught in Nowata.
M: What did she teach you?
JA: First, second, and third grade.
M: Okay. Did she have to give you a whipping too?
JA: The first day I was at school. [laughs]
M: You got a whipping from her the first day. You brought that in.
[both laugh]
JA: Yeah.
M: What was that whipping about?
JA: She told me to do something and I said I didn’t have to do it because my father ran the school. She said but she ran that classroom. It started from there, and every time I’d see her up until the time she died, she’d just start laughing and say, “You were a bad little bundle.” [laughs] I always did see her.
M: That’s good. Even though you were getting all those whippings, did you enjoy school?
JA: I enjoyed it. I looked forward to going.
M: What kind of student grade-wise would you say you were?
JA: I was, up through high school, I was about A-.
M: What would you do for fun? You mentioned you played basketball. Did you do anything else for fun?
JA: I played football one year in Nowata. I graduated here in Oklahoma City my senior year. I went swimming, fishing, a little bit of everything.
M: [pause] Would you tell us when you said your father was your principal, when you left Nowata, what grade were you in?
JA: I had just finished eleventh grade. I came to Oklahoma City as a senior in high school.
M: When you came to Oklahoma City, was your father still your principal?
JA: No. F.D. Moon was the principal. I went to the one school that you could go to and that was Douglass.
M: And F.D. Moon -
Both: Was the principal.
M: Where did your father go to work at the time?
JA: He came here and was the principal at Truman Elementary School for about four or five years until they moved to F.D. Moon off of 6th and High, off of Park. He was principal there until he retired.
M: When he was the principal at F.D. Moon on Park Street –
JA: I think that’s where it was.
M: Yeah, it was on Park. I had a chance to do some work up under him when I was a young teacher, as a student teacher. I had gone to school there under him as a principal, so when I saw you out there, I couldn’t pass up bringing you in because I just thought that was kind of special. When you went to college, you say you were in Atlanta. You want to talk about the studies you did in Atlanta?
JA: I majored in Business Administration and played basketball. I had a joyous time because there was nobody around that knew my parents. That’s why - I’d never heard of Morris Brown before, but Reverend Alexander, who used to be the pastor at Avery, asked me where I was going to college. I hadn’t made up my mind, and he said, “I can get you a scholarship at Morris Brown.” I said, “Where is it?” He said, “Atlanta, Georgia.” I asked how far it was. He said, “About a thousand miles.” I said, “Write them and tell them I’m coming.” [M laughs] That’s where I went.
M: He helped you in.
JA: They gave me an academic scholarship for about $75 a semester. Wasn’t too much. I had that for one semester, and then I acquired an athletic scholarship as a walk-on in basketball.
M: That’s excellent. Did you go any further in your studies, your college studies, or did you complete your education there?
JA: I got my Bachelor’s degree. I didn’t go any further. The only time I tried to go further was to keep from going to the service.
M: Did you have to go to the service?
JA: I got drafted.
M: Where did you go?
JA: I took basic at Fort Carson, Colorado, and then I was stationed at Fort Riley, Kansas. Then I went to Germany for six months’ TDY, which is temporary duty. Then I came back to the United States and got discharged in 1963.
M: What branch?
JA: The Army. The only one that was drafting. [both laugh]
M: The Army is the only one that drafted?
JA: At that time, yeah.
M: How many years did you serve?
JA: I spent 21 months. They made me a company clerk, and I went in reading up on how you could get out early. [M laughs] I typed up my own paperwork, got it approved, and got out three months early.
M: That is very unusual.
[both laugh]
M: Could you talk about your career? What kind of career have you had, Mr. Alexander?
JA: It kind of varied. I worked for – let me see – about six or seven companies.
M: You want to name those companies?
JA: I worked for Western Electric, and started working for them in 1960. The only job I could get was working in the shop. They would never hire me in the office, saying I had the wrong attitude.
M: [laughing] My goodness. That attitude was getting you in trouble.
JA: It didn’t get me in trouble.
M: They said you had the wrong attitude.
JA: I had the wrong attitude because I took a stand against prejudice. I’d always speak out about it. I stayed there until I got drafted in the service in ’61. I came back and went to work out there in ‘63. Finally they gave me a test for the office, and they told me that I didn’t qualify. I asked them to clarify “qualify.” If I wasn’t qualified to take the test, then I shouldn’t be dealing with it, and if I wasn’t qualified because of the academic education that I had – then they told me I didn’t pass the test, and I bet them money that I did. They got mad. Then they told me they didn’t have any openings. I gave my two weeks’ notice and went to work for the post office about four or five months until I got tired of that. I left and went to Atlanta and stayed a year, and then came back and I went to work for IBM for about six years. I think it’d be about six. I worked in accounts receivable and I applied for sales. They didn’t have any openings, and I wrote in on them to corporate headquarters.
M: You protested.
JA: Yeah. [laughs]
M: Way to go.
JA: Finally, a letter came down that they had to hire Black in every IBM office in the United States, and especially in Oklahoma City. They interviewed 50 to hire one. It got down to myself and another fellow, and they told me they weren’t going to hire me in Oklahoma City because I’d given them a bad name because I’d written that letter. I told them I’d write another. They told me they had a sales position open in Springfield.
M: Missouri?
JA: They didn’t say Springfield, Missouri. They just told me Springfield. I was looking forward to going to another Springfield in Ohio or Illinois or anywhere. They sent me to Springfield, Missouri and I lasted a year and a half. I came back and I went to work for Clay-Tex for a year, and then I worked for several other companies. Then I finally decided to work for myself, so I’ve been doing that ever since.
M: What is your company?
JA: Dab Industries.
M: What do you primarily provide?
JA: I sell register paper for cash registers, and then if they use the ribbon, I sell that. A few other related products, such as ink jet cartridges and laser printer cartridges to the same customers. I sell mostly to restaurants.
M: You’ve been in business for your own company for how many years would you say?
JA: About 23. I’ve been broke about three or four times.
M: You’ve been broke. [laughs] But you’re in business at this time as we speak.
JA: Still there.
M: Well, you know the way it is when you’re an entrepreneur. I’m a retired entrepreneur and that’s just business. That’s the way it is. You’re still here so you got a product that the public buys, so that’s a good thing. What advice would you give to somebody that wanted to be in their own business based on your experience at being in your own business?
JA: I would suggest finding an area is a need that they could provide, and then start knocking on doors to get customers. Always have a business card because a lot of us, when you say, “Do you have a card?” I always have a card. If I go out of town, I’ve got business cards in my pocket because you never know who you’re going to run in to. I’ve met some other people. They write something down on a piece of paper, which is eventually thrown away anyway, but most of the time people keep the cards.
M: That’s true. Are you married?
JA: Have been. Been divorced since – let’s see. 1968 or ’67. I have one son that’s 42.
M: Is your son from that marriage?
JA: Mm-hmm. (Note: means yes.)
M: Would you like to name your former wife and your son in your interview?
JA: My former wife’s name is Myla Alexander. She still retains the Alexander part of her name.
M: And your son?
JA: My son’s name is Kermit, like Kermit the Frog, Alexander.
M: Does Kermit, your son, have any children?
JA: He has four.
M: Okay. Let’s name your grandbabies.
JA: I can’t name them all.
M: You can’t name them all? They’re going to get you when they hear this interview.
JA: I don’t care. They’re in California.
M: What part of California?
JA: I’d have to ask their mother. He has three boys and a girl.
M: Do you have any advice that you would give to a person who is trying to raise children? Your father was a principal. Your mother was a teacher. You got many whippings yourself as a boy coming up.
JA: I deserved most of them.
M: You have a son and four grandchildren. Is there some advice you would like to give from your experiences in life and around educators that would help us to do a better job in raising our children?
JA: Well, one thing about it is whatever they’re doing, participate in it. Participate in school activities. Inquire as to how they’re doing in school and always check on them. Then, make sure that you discipline. You don’t necessarily have to whip them, but be forceful in mind that they’re supposed to do the right thing.
M: And there are consequences.
JA: Yeah. Consequences. A lot of people, they wait too late to start trying to discipline their kids, and after awhile, instead of them being the boss, the kid is the boss. I didn’t have that problem. I’ve been divorced from my son’s mother since he was about two or three, but I always kept in contact. He played basketball. I went to all the games. It makes a difference when the parent is sitting there. Coming up in elementary school when they would have parent-teacher conferences, she’d tell me it was going on and I would make it.
M: What do you remember – I’m going to kind of switch over and talk to you about something I’ve asked most of the people that I’ve been interviewing because I have some work and writing that I’m doing in this area. What do you remember about the Oklahoma City bombing that day that the bombing occurred, April 19, 1995?
JA: The day that the bombing occurred, I was on my way out to Midwest City. I went to Target, and that building is so well-solidified you couldn’t hear the bombing. When I came out and turned my radio on in the car, I thought it was some type of joke, that it didn’t really happen. Midwest City is kind of elevated above Oklahoma City, and on the way the back to Oklahoma City, I could see all the smoke coming from Downtown, in that area. I had known some people that worked in that area and I called and checked on them. A couple got killed in the Social Security building. That particular morning, I needed a tag on my car. It was only about 7:30 or a quarter to eight that I was on 8th and Broadway getting my safety sticker, and I left there. Later on, I found out that all the windows were blown out of that particular place.
M: Where you had gotten that business transaction.
JA: Yeah. Had I been there around 9:00 – yeah. That’s mostly what I remember about it.
M: Would you like to share your religious beliefs with us?
JA: My religious belief?
M: Yes.
JA: Well, I believe in God. I haven’t gone to church as much as I should, but I go. I believe it’s necessary. I get something out of it whenever I go. My parents, especially my mother, was a strong believer in religion, and I always have been, so I guess I always will be. You know, I believe in God. I think of a lot of things that have and haven’t happened to me during my lifetime, so that’s as far as it goes.
M: Mr. Alexander, we are really thankful that you would take time from your schedule, especially on such a short notice, and give us this interview. We think that because you were able to give your history and your father and mother were both prominent Oklahomans, [rustling, door creaks] and yourself being able to maintain your business all this time. We really, really appreciate you being one of the Oklahoma Voices. Thank you very much.
JA: One thing I forgot to mention is my father was – my grandfather was in Oklahoma. He was one-time president of Langston.
M: Oh? What was his name?
JA: John Marcus.
M: He was one of Langston’s presidents?
JA: Yes.
M: Okay. And he is your - ?
JA: My mother’s father.
M: Your mother’s father. That is very significant. He was one of Langston’s presidents.
JA: Yes, and I have been a supporter of Langston even though I didn’t go to Langston. A lot of people think I went. My father went to Langston. My brother went to Langston. Like I said, it was too close, and I wanted to get out of here.
M: Where did your mother go to school?
JA: She went to Fisk. She wanted me to go to Fisk.
M: Okay, well, you did want to travel, and with Reverend Robert H. Alexander’s help, you took on down to the South.
JA: He was from Georgia and his wife had gone to Morris Brown, too.
M: Right. Well, we really want to thank you for being one of the Oklahoma Voices, and I’m glad that you didn’t let this interview close out without telling us that your grandfather was one of Langston University’s former presidents. I’m a Langston graduate, so we are very thankful.
JA: Used to have a dormitory named after him until they tore it down.
Both: Marcus Hall.
M: They don’t have Marcus Hall anymore?
JA: No.
M: They had Marcus Hall when I was a student and we will put it in this interview. It’s a dormitory for men. Thank you very much.
JA: You’re welcome.
End of Interview.