Description:
Julie Dwyer talks about her work with the Free Mom Hugs group.
Transcript:
Interviewer: Sheldon Beach
Interviewee: Julie Dwyer
SB: I'm Sheldon Beach with the Metropolitan Library System. Today is July 15, 2021, and I'm here today with Julie Dwyer from Free Mom Hugs. We're just going to talk about you and your life and how you got involved with the Free Mom Hugs Organization, kind of what you all do, so. First, tell me a little about yourself.
JD: Well, I am a native Oklahoman, I was born in Norman and have lived there most of my life, grew up in a pretty simple family, you know, mom, dad, I have a younger sister who's, I think like every younger sister, just a little crazy. Met my husband, I had--first husband was who I had my kids with--and they're the reason I got into working with Free Mom Hugs. After we separated and remarried now, my current husband, he works with the University of Oklahoma and we're very proud of him there, and I work as a yoga therapist with a hospital.
SB: So, when did you first get involved with Free Mom Hugs, and how did that come about?
JD: Oh, so, I want to say the first semester of sixth grade, my son came to me and told me he was gay, which I’d kind of had an inkling, but I was waiting for him to tell me his story. It was actually kind of funny, he had befriended another student that was sadly living at the homeless shelter with her mother and attending school, and I thought he was going to ask if she could come live with us, and she's standing right there as this is happening and I'm panicking and going, how do I explain to my child that people aren't puppies, you just can’t take them off and, you know, take them home with you. So, when he told me he was gay my reaction was, oh thank God, because I know how to deal with this. But it made me realize he was nervous to tell me that he was gay, and I've always been... had friends in the LGBT community, I've been a big supporter, but even with everything that I knew I felt, my son still was nervous to tell me, and it made me realize I wasn't doing enough to show him how I felt. So I started looking at ways I could be active in showing him that I supported him in that community and I'd heard about Free Mom Hugs, and so I looked them up and it turned out they were doing a volunteer drive and I got on their little Google form and signed up, and being kind of ignorant to how that worked, I checked all the boxes because I was like, thinking, use me wherever you need me. And I got a call about a week later saying well great, we're going to put you in as the Central Area Coordinator, that's the entire Metro that you're going to be in charge of, and I think I’m on every committee that we have, and so I went from having never worked with an organization like theirs to all of a sudden being just, you know, two feet in, all the way. And then the pandemic hit, and one of our main things is being there in person and hugging and you can't do that in a pandemic, so we started working on community outreach at that point, of how can we still let people know we're here and we support them and we care, how can we still continue conversations with civic leaders and politicians, without actually being there in person, so that's what we've been doing until just recently.
SB: So, what kind of things does the organization do? I know you don't just stand on the side of parades and hug people.
JD: [laughs] No. That is, in my opinion, probably my favorite part, but we really work on being advocates, being educators and celebrators. So, we want to let everyone in the LGBT community know that we celebrate them, and we want them to know that they are loved. And that can be standing at the side of a parade hugging everybody, it can be showing up to city council meetings, it can be showing up to protests or even just going out to LGBT events and letting them know we're here, we support you. And that's part of the advocacy is showing up and letting civic leaders and politicians understand that it's not just affecting people who identify as LGBT, it is affecting parents, friends, loved ones, families, that there's a community, it's not just the small group of people, it's the people who love them, it’s the people who care about them too, and we can't just say we care, we have to show them. So we do that. And then we provide education. We're working on teacher packets this year, so if a teacher wants to let students know that they're a safe space or that they're supportive, we send them educational information on resources, the different health systems that are in place for students if they need assistance with health care, letting them know even something as simple as introducing themselves with their pronouns and it's kind of a way for the students to say oh, well, you know, Miss Susan introduced herself as she and her, that must mean it's safe for me to also tell her my pronouns. And educating parents who maybe don't know how to navigate working through a child who has just come out or a family member who's just come out to them, they may have questions that they may not feel comfortable answering—asking, or maybe they're worried that they're going to be offensive or upsetting to ask. So, it's safe to ask us because we're there to educate.
SB: How do you go about doing that as a parent of a child with the LGBT community? What do you do with other parents?
JD: Oh, that's a great question. So, recently I had a parent come to me and their oldest child is questioning. They're not sure kind of where they stand but they're sure that they're not completely straight. And so this parent has been asking me questions about pronouns, or what the correct language is to use in talking about this kind of stuff, because she doesn't want to upset her child, she wants to support her and respect her, but she understands that there's a gap in the knowledge. And so there's a ton of good resources out there. We have our own list, there's a ton of resources locally, think places like the library that have wonderful books, or I know UCO has a great I think it's the Women's and BLGT Center, I always mangle their name, but they're a great resource and it's provided by educators who are providing evidence-based information. And there's a lot of great community outreach that's going on with healthcare, so Variety Care has a great teen and youth outreach program. I'm going to mangle this too, I think it's Revan Health Services, they provide great information and outreach programs so getting them in touch with people who can help. We constantly have parents asking us, where's a church that's affirming? Because for a lot of families their faith is a part of who they are, and they want their child to still feel like they can go and be loved and accepted. They'll ask about where's a counselor or a therapist that we can go talk to who is affirming? And so, we amass those resources and have them ready when parents need them.
SB: So, I’m curious about the organization itself. How large is the organization? Do you have any idea?
JD: I don't have specific numbers. So, it was started by a woman named Sarah who is fantastic, and her son Parker Cunningham came out to her years ago and she went through the struggles of being a parent who, her child just told her he's gay and what does she do, and the struggles that she went through, and she's very open about those. And through all of that, she went to her first Pride with him, and she came with a button she made that said, “free mom hugs.” And the thing that she took away from that experience was the amount of hurt that there was from families that had rejected their brother, sister, child, mother. And how there was this need for that support. So, she started Free Mom Hugs. And it was started here in Oklahoma City and now has spread, we have a chapter in every single state in the US, I don't know, I don't know the numbers exactly but it's growing and every time we go to an event we have people coming up and, how can I get involved and everything from people who just want to write letters of support to people who go out and stand on the side of the road and give hugs. There's something for everybody there but it's in just a few years gone nationwide.
SB: What kind of response do you get from people when you tell them this is what you do?
JD: Oh, typically I get asked for a hug, which is fun, especially now thank goodness for the vaccine. But most of the time, at least in my experience, I have people asking, can they help? Can they sign up? What can they do? I've had dads ask, can dads come give hugs too? And, yes, we have the dad hug shirts and a lot of people asking about information. You know, what do you guys do? How do you outreach? And funnily enough, a lot of times they'll come, and they'll find we do this and say, oh, well my child told me that they're this or, oh, I have a brother who's gay or oh, my mom is a lesbian and has been living with her wife for years and years now and I'm glad to see something is here. A lot of times from just the people that we meet when we're out it's a mix, we get at the Pride recently a lot of people coming by getting hugs and they cry and say I don't know why I'm crying, my parents love me, and the opposite of crying and saying my parents kicked me out, I've been living with a friend for the last year. Or, I've had to run away because I don't have a safe place to be, and it's just a mix. It really is. But it's positive. I, fortunately I have not had anybody be negative or rude to me, but I'm sure it's just a matter of time.
SB: I was going to ask about that, actually. Are there difficulties being in a place like Oklahoma City where it’s seen as little more conservative?
JD: You know, Oklahoma City is actually not that bad. I, you know we just recently had the Pride in Downtown and that I can remember I don't think we saw any protesters. We actually went, Dunc--the city of Duncan just had their first Pride. And the two guys who put it together were phenomenal, they did such a good job, and you know, Duncan, Oklahoma, it's definitely much more conservative and we were warned there may be some pushback and surprisingly no, no one showed up. Our take on it is don't engage, they have a right to have their opinions and their views, but we're just not going to engage that. So, going to the city council meetings where people are actually speaking out against Pride displays or the Pride parades and gatherings, those are a little more, those are a little bit more difficult to bite your tongue and try to rise above, but what I look at is, again, they have the right to have those opinions and views and I just bring numbers to the table, factually how this affects the community at large, it's not just the LGBT community, it's, again, the people who love them that are affected by this. It's our children and our grandparents. And so, trying to educate whoever is making the decisions at that point of why that support is lifesaving. So far that’s been what we've done.
SB: You know, you talk about why this work is lifesaving and the numbers and everything, can you maybe talk a little bit more about that? About maybe like why a group like yours is so important?
JD: Yes. So, there are some great resources online, the Trevor Project is wonderful in reporting just the hard numbers of what it's like for our LGBT youth and community, and I told you earlier we have about an estimate of 7% of teens identify as LGBTQ. Conversely, they make up about 40% of the homeless teen population, whether they were kicked out or moved out for safety, that's the reality. On top of that, they're more likely to self-harm, because they don't have support and on that, they've shown that if a youth has just one adult, it doesn't have to be a mom or dad, it can be a teacher, a librarian, someone, if they have support, that can decrease their likelihood of harming themselves by 30%. It's huge. So now imagine if they have parents who maybe don't know what they're doing but they've talked to someone at Free Mom Hugs and we've held their hand and helped them navigate this, or we've put them in touch with a therapist who can help them navigate that, and because they have that education they understand that this doesn't mean that there's anything wrong with their child or their brother or mother or whomever, that education can be the difference in that support and that can literally save that person's life. So that's why we feel so passionately about that. Looking at the homeless teens if you are living in an area where you don't have a lot of support, you don't have a lot of resources, one of the safe places to go that you don't have to pay to be there is the library. So, getting to walk in there and see that there are books and information for you, as a gay teen or bisexual teen, you can see okay here's a place where I can be where it's safe, where I'm not going to be abused or mistreated. Here's a place where I can come and ask questions if I need help, and again, that literally makes the difference.
SB: Do you personally have any stories or anything of, that people have told you about how you've helped them?
JD: Oh, I mean, again, I'm so new to the organization, I started just before the pandemic, and we've been unable to be in public because of that, so the few I've had were recently, actually, at the Pride there was this beautiful person sitting on a bench and I was walking around looking for my kids and they had a trans pride flag on and they jumped up and said "Free Mom Hugs!" because we have our shirts that say that, can I have a hug? Of course. And you go and hug them, and I always try to say what I want to hear from my mom. I'm so happy you're here, you're amazing, just something. And I'm sorry, I'm getting a little emotional. And they started crying and they said I don't know, I don’t know why I'm crying, my mom loves me, she supports me, but my dad died before I came out and I always wonder if he would still love me now. And what do you do? You can't speak for that person, they're gone, and all I can say is, in that case, if your mom loved him and she loves you, can you not imagine that he would have loved you too? Like, I don't think he would have been very different in opinion from her. Giving teachers resource packets, that's been big, I've had a lot of teachers over the past year who because they're teaching through Zoom, how do we let our kids know we're safe? How do we let them know that we support them? And educating them on, throw your pronouns in your Zoom name. Or sign your emails to them with those pronouns. Pop a rainbow sticker up on your computer or pop it up in the background, they will see it and they will know what that means. It’s, it doesn't have to be this big overt display, but just little things like that including literature and reading that isn't just from straight authors. Or straight stories. There's a lot you can do but that's been our biggest outreach program, and then just talking one on one to the families. It's been nice to have people come and ask me, oh hey, my child thinks they might identify as transgender, what do I do? How do I help them? And having that list of resources, oh girl, hold on, I got all this stuff for you. In those moments knowing, okay, I have something that can help you and your child keep that tight bond, that to me is really what I like. Almost more than the hugs, but not quite.
SB: So, what does your son think of you doing all this?
JD: He is a little introverted sometimes, so, he comes with me to almost all of the Pride events that we've gone to, my daughter has as well, he's sweet, he's just funny, I don't know--I mean, I think we've had talks because I've always been supportive, my husband is, at OU at least, the designated ally for his department, so he's the safe space for people there, so my son’s grown up with just a fully supporting family, and I mean he thinks it's cool, he comes with us to the parades and he’ll hold the flag and because his interaction with other people has been very limited this last year, he's not really had any interactions that haven't been completely positive. So, we'll see as he navigates further through life, if he's still proud. And in conversations I've had with my daughter, she just came out earlier this year and in talking to her about those, we've had some great conversations, and I always try to thank them for trusting me enough to speak to me about this, and she actually said that she felt like because of what I do with Free Mom Hugs that she knows she can trust me and have those conversations with me, and that is the most amazing gift that they've ever given me is just knowing that they feel like they can trust me.
SB: Do their friends also talk to you the same way?
JD: Yeah, yeah, they're fun, we're kind of getting this little wonderful group of just these amazing, unique kids, and they each have their own story and their own, just their own really neat personality. And it's funny because one of them we took to Pride with us and they friended me on Instagram, which I was like, oh, I'm the cool mom, friends on Instagram, but they posted about it and they said for the first time in their life they felt safe, they felt like they could just be themselves and not feel like they had to behave a certain way or act a certain way, that they just felt at home. And that to me is very touching. I want them all to feel that way. You know, I want them all to feel like they're loved, and they're welcomed, and one of the parents that actually came with me to Pride, we were walking around, and she commented, I can't believe everyone here is so nice. And I was thinking about it and thinking, most of the people here at some point have faced criticism or being rejected or being harmed or bullied because of who they are, and so when they get here, they've all been through that together, individually but now they're here together, and so it's just this, like, sharing of loving and celebrating each other because they know at the end of that they're going to go back and they're going to go back to that world that's not as nice and not as kind and loving and so for this one moment they get that, just, celebration.
SB: I want to go back to something you said earlier, you said you've always been friends with people in the LGBT community and everything. Have you seen a difference in your son's generation with groups like this available and with information available?
JD: Yes. Hugely so. You know, I'm 37 so I'm like 20 years out of high school at this point, but I remember in high school I knew one gay person who was openly gay, and it was, he was not treated kindly. The butt of many jokes, and there wasn't a support group on campus, there wasn't, I never read a book about Pride or even heard about Pride in high school. And you know, as we've gotten out of high school, I've seen many of my classmates come out in these past few years and realizing like, oh man, they probably knew in high school, and they did not feel safe coming out. Whereas now, like, at my son's school they have a support group there that's just for the LGBT kids and it's hosted by a teacher and it's very supportive. There's PFLAG and, I mean, there’s just so many groups now that are getting parents to reach out and be that support. Most notably, I was talking with a dear friend of my husband's, he grew up in Meeker, Oklahoma which is not a super LGBT friendly place especially 20 years ago, and he was talking to me about what I'm doing with Free Mom Hugs, and he said I never thought I'd see a day where Oklahoma would have this. Would have that group. He said I didn't think I would see it especially this quickly. So, I think people my age and my generation are seeing our friends who didn't feel safe then coming out now and realizing we need to make it better for those, for the kids that are there now and actually doing something about it, which is really cool, and there's great information available through lots of wonderful groups.
SB: It's funny that he would say that about not seeing a place like, or a thing like that in Oklahoma when it actually started here.
JD: Yeah, yeah, and that was when Free Mom Hugs first popped on my radar, I think I was reading an article where Sarah Cunningham, the woman who started this, she actually had said, if your parents won't be there for your wedding, I will, I'll be your mom. And so, she had actually gone as the stand-in mom to a wedding. And I've been married, I know I rely on my mom for so much, and to not have a mom there, to not have someone there to help you, not because they've passed but because they've chosen not to, I can't imagine that pain. And so, obviously, that's not going to replace your mom, but to have somebody to stand there and be proud for you and to help you through that day, it really resonated with me and so that's when I started looking them up and read her book and then found out, oh my gosh, she's from Oklahoma City? Are you kidding me? As I'm reading the book, she's got, like, locations I've been to and I'm like, this is wild, I can't, I can't imagine, I've got to go and find out more and sign up, so.
SB: So, if somebody was to listen to this and say hey, I'd like to be involved, how can they do that?
JD: Go to freemomhugs.org, it's our website, you can find your local chapter divided by state and then in Oklahoma we divide it by areas. So, there's a central area, northeast, southeast, northwest, southwest. And, or you can find us on Facebook, we're all over Facebook, and, yeah, I hope everybody wants to come check us out.
SB: Well, Julie, thank you very much for coming down and taking the time to talk to me.
JD: Yeah, thank you for having me, it's been really fun.